A 2010 debate between Late Christopher Hitchens vs Tariq Ramadan – Is Islam a Religion of Peace?
Fanaticism, fundamentalism, superstition and ignorance. Religion is getting a bad press these days. Much of the conflict in the world, from the Middle East to Nigeria and Myanmar, is often blamed on religion.
But how are things from a different perspective? Defenders of religion claim Adolf Hitler was an atheist. Communism under Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot or Mao Zedong banned religion, but also massacred millions. And science brought incredible and amazing advances, but also pollution and the atomic bomb.
A critic of religious dogmatism, Professor Richard Dawkins revolutionised genetics in 1976 with the publication of The Selfish Gene, which explained how evolution takes place at the genetic level. He has since written 12 more bestsellers, including The God Delusion which sold millions of copies, was translated into more than 30 languages, and catapulted him to the position of the world’s foremost atheist.
Mehdi Hasan interviews evolutionary biologist Richard Dawkins at the Oxford Union and asks: Is religion a force for good or evil? Can it co-exist with science? Is science the new religion? And why if god does not exist, is religion so persistent?
Debate: Jesus or Mohammed: Which one is relevant to today’s society?
Jay Smith vs Sami Zataari
29th February 2012
Enter video caption here
Source : MDI
Muslim Students Association & Christian Club of Henry Ford Community College Present- Debate – JESUS – Prophet or God?
Donald Wolan – Pastor and Mission Team Leader of Downriver Christian Community Church in Melvindale, MI
Shadid Lewis – Convert to Islam, member of the Muslim Debate Initiative & President of the Hampton Islamic Center in Hampton, VA
Source : thedebateinitiative.com
Muslim v Christian Debate: Is Jesus God?
Abdullah Kunde v Jason Sabalow
Date : 28 March 2012
Source : thedebateinitiative.com
prev. (Creator or Creation)
Why People Believe God is Man?
What led ancient people to have the belief that the God became man or that God and man were one and the same? The fundamental reason was their inability to understand or accept the concept of God creating this world from nothingness. They perceived God to be like themselves, creating from what already exists. Humans create things by manipulating existing things into other states, shapes and forms having different functions. For example, a wooden table was once a tree in a forest, and its nails and screws were once iron ore in rocks underneath the earth. Humans cut down the tree and shaped its wood into a tabletop and legs; they dug up the iron ore, melted it and poured in into moulds to produce nails and screws. Then they assembled the pieces to create a table for a variety of uses. Similarly, the plastic chairs people now sit on were once liquid oil, stored deep in the bowels of the earth. One cannot imagine sitting on oil the way people sit on chairs. However, through the human ability to manipulate the chemical components of oil, plastic is produced and chairs are made for humans to sit on. This is the essence of human activity; humans already merely modify and transform what already exists.
They do not create the trees or produce the oil. When they discuss oil production, they really mean oil extraction. The oil was created millions of years before by geological processes; than humans extracted it from the earth and refined it. They also did not creating the trees.
Even if they planted them, they did not create the seeds that they planted. Consequently, human, in their ignorance of God, often conceive of God as being just like them. For example, in the Old Testament, it is written, “God created man after his own image; in the image of God he created Man.”
For Hindus, Purusa is the creator God, Brahma, in human form, and just as humans create by manipulating the existing world around them, than the creator god must do likewise.
According to Hindu philosophy, Purusa is a giant offspring of Brahma, having a thousand heads and a thousand eyes. From him arose Viraaj , his feminine counterpart and mate in the creation process. The divine Purusa is also the sacrificial offering (vv. 6-10) and from his dismembered body arose the four traditional social castes (varnas). Perusa Hymn states that Brahmins were Purusa’s mouth;
Ksatriyas (noblemen), his arms; Vaishyas, his thighs; and Shoodras, his feet.
The Hindus’ inability to conceive of God creating this world from nothing, led them to the concept of God creating the world from himself and its people from His body parts.
Human ability to understand ideas and concepts is limited and finite. Human beings cannot grasp and understand the infinite. The belief, which God taught Adam, was that God created this world from nothing. When He wanted something to exist, He merely said, “Be!” and His command brought into existence those things that did not previously exist. This world and its contents were not created from Him-self. In fact, the concept of God creating the world from Himself re-duces God to the level of His creatures, who merely create something from something else. Those who held and continue to hold this belief are unable to grasp the uniqueness of God. He is Uniquely One and there is nothing like Him. If He had created the world from Himself, he would be like His creatures.
Did God Become Man?
The question which remains is Did God become Man? Logically speaking, the answer is no because the concept of God becoming man contradicts the basic meaning of the term “God.” People commonly say that God is able to do all things; whatever He wants to do, He can do. In the Bible of Christians it is said,
“… through God all things are possible (Matthew, 19: 26; Mark 10: 27, 14: 36).”
The Qur’aan of Muslims states,
“Indeed, Allah (God) is able to do all things.” [Surah Baqarah (2):20]
…and the Hindu scriptures carry texts of similar meanings .
All the major religious texts contain general expressions regarding the basic concept of God’s omnipotence. He is Greater than all things, and through Him all things are possible. If this general concept is to be translated into practical terms, one has to first identify and understand the basic attributes of God. Most societies perceive God as an eternal being without beginning or end. If, on the basis that God is able to do all things, and it was asked whether God could die, what would be the answer? Since dying is part of “all things,” can it be said, “If He wants to?” Of course this cannot be said.
So, there is a problem here. God is defined as being ever-living, with-out end, and dying means “coming to an end.” Consequently, to ask if He can die is actually a nonsensical question. It is self- contradictory.
Similarly, to ask whether God can be born, is also absurd because God has already been defined as eternal, having no beginning. Being born means having a beginning, coming into existence after not existing. In this same vein, atheist philosophers enjoy asking theists:
“Can God create a stone too heavy for Him to lift?” If the theist says yes, it means that God can create something greater than Himself. And if he says no, it means that God is unable to do all things.
Therefore, the term “all things” in the phrase “God is able to do all things” excludes the absurdities. It cannot include things that contradict His divine attributes; things that would make Him less than God, like, forgetting, sleeping, repenting, growing, eating, etc. In-stead, it includes only “all things” that are consistent with Him being God. This is what the statement “God is able to do all things” means. It cannot be understood in the absolute sense; it must be qualified.
The claim that God became man is also an absurdity. It is not befitting of God to take on human characteristics because it means that the Creator has become His creation. However, the creation is a product of the creative act of the Creator. If the Creator became His creation, it would mean that the Creator created Himself, which is an obvious absurdity. To be created, He would first have to not exist, and, if He did not exist, how could He then create? Furthermore, if He were created, it would mean that He had a beginning, which also contradicts His being eternal. By definition creation is in need of a creator. For created beings to exist they must have a creator to bring them into existence. God cannot need a creator because God is the Creator. Thus, there is an obvious contradiction in terms. The claim that God became His creation implies that He would need a creator, which is a ludicrous concept. It contradicts the fundamental concept of God being uncreated, needing no creator and being the Creator .
Can Man Become God?
Man is a finite being (i.e., creation). Man is born, and he dies. These are characteristics which cannot be attributed to God because they equate Him with His creation. Therefore, God did not and will not ever become man. On the other hand, man also cannot become God. The created cannot become its own creator. The created at one time did not exist. It came into being by the creative act of a Creator who always existed. What is nonexistent cannot make itself exist .
As for the parallel concept that the human soul or spirit is divine, it is a way of claiming that man can become God. This philosophy forms the foundation of Greek, Christian and Muslim mysticism, as well as Hindu theology, and extends divinity to all humans and possibly all living creatures. It starts from the premise that, at some time in the history of the universe, bits and pieces of God became surrounded by material bodies and were confined to the earth. In other words, the infinite became contained in the finite . This belief attributes pure evil to God and ultimately eliminates the meaning of good and evil all together. When the human soul intends evil and does it by God’s permission, such an act is purely evil and worthy of punishment.
Hence, the concept of karma was invented. Whatever goes around comes around. Karma explains inexplicable suffering by claiming that it is the consequence of evil in a previous life. God ultimately punishes any evil done by the parts of Himself within man. However, if human souls have independent wills from God, they cannot be at the same time God. Thus, each human becomes himself a god.
Did God have a Son?
If God did not become Man, did He have a son? Since He is able to do all things, He should be able to have a son. However, this claim reduces God to the lowly status of His creation. Creatures procreate by giving birth to mini versions of themselves that later grow up and reproduce copies of themselves, and so on and so forth. Dogs have puppies, cats have kittens, cows have calves, and men have children.
So, what does God have – a baby God? Gods must give birth to Gods. But, for God to have a son, there has to exist another God besides Him. It is not befitting for God to have a son as such an act equates Him with His creation.
Everything other than God comes into existence by the commandment of God, not that God becomes His creation or a part of God be-comes creation. God does not become His creation nor does God give birth to creation. God is God, the Creator, and man and the contents of the universe are His creation. Although humans cannot grasp the concept of creation from nothing, that is exactly what God did and does. He alone creates from nothing, which 1s among the attributes that make Him unique and distinct from His creation. His act of creation is entirely different from that of human beings .
This was the essence of the message of all the true messengers and prophets of God sent to humanity – Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad – as well as those sent throughout the world whose names are now unknown to humanity – may God’s peace and blessings be on them all. Today, this precise message can only be found in the Qur’aan; the last scripture revealed by God to humankind. The message remains loud and clear only in the Qur’aan because it has remained unchanged since the time of its revelation, one thousand four hundred years ago, until today.
God states in the Qur’aan for those who make Him like His creation or vice versa:
“There is nothing similar to Him.”[Surah ash-Shooraa (42):11]
He also states for those who attributed to Him a son:
“But it is not suitable for Ar-Rahmaan (the Most Beneficent -Allah) that He should beget a child.” [Surah Maryam (19):92]
He further states for those who believe that He created the world from Himself:
“If He wishes anything to exist, He merely commands it:
‘Be’, and it is.” [Surah Yaa Seen (36):82]
For the polytheists He states:
“There was no other god along with Him, for if there were each would have taken away what he created and tried to overcome the other.” [Surah al-Mu´minoon (23):91]
He asks the atheists:
“Did nothing create them or did they create them-selves?” [Surah at-Toor (52):35]
And in reference to Je sus and his mother, Mary, He confirmed their humanity by saying simply:
“They both used to eat food.” [Surah al-Maa`idah (5):75]
The concept of God not becoming man is very important for every human being to grasp because it lies at the foundation of the difference between Islam and all other existing religions. All other religions have a distorted concept of God, to one degree or another. The most important idea which needs to be understood, is that God did not become man. God is unique; He alone deserves to be worshipped by His creation. To believe that a man is God or that a man became God and to worship that man is the greatest sin and the greatest evil that humans can do on this earth. This understanding is most important because it forms the foundation for salvation . There can be no salvation without it. However, this belief alone is not the key salvation. True, correct belief must be translated into practice, and not merely remain in the realm of knowledge, for it to become pure faith.
A person has to live a righteous life based on the correct belief to attain salvation. Nevertheless, the starting point is, knowing who God is, knowing that God never became and will never become a human being.
Bilal Philip – Did God Become Men
Despite growing evidence that man is hard-wired with a “physical facility for belief,” the fact that the concept of God has varied greatly among human societies still leads some thinkers, even those who believe in God, to conclude that religions must be man-made. However, thorough research reveals a common theological thread linking the various religions. That link is the belief in a Supreme Being among the various gods, a monotheistic foundation that can be found in even the most externally pantheistic of religious systems. For example, the concept of God in Hinduism exists as a single example among many religions, which supports the view that human beings were originally monotheistic and through various degenerative processes became polytheistic. In spite of its many gods and idols, Hinduism has a single Supreme God above all, Brahman.
Traditionally, most anthropologists have concluded that religion devolved from various stages of polytheism to monotheism, beginning with early man’s deification of the forces of nature, then, eventually, devolving into ditheism to consolidate all of the supernatural powers into two main gods (a god of good and a god of evil), and, finally, simplifying into a belief in one god, monotheism.
Thus, religion, according to anthropologists and social scientists, has no divine origin; it is merely a by-product of the evolution of early man’s superstitions, based on his lack of scientific knowledge. Hence, these same theoreticians believe that science will eventually unlock all of the secrets of nature, resulting in the disuse of religion to explain natural phenomena, and, the consequential extinction of religion altogether.
Man’s innate belief in a Supreme Being, however, seems to support the opposite view, proposing instead that man began as a monotheist, but in time, strayed into various forms of polytheism. This view is further supported by fact that all of the so-called primitive tribes, which have been “discovered,” have been found to hold a belief in a Supreme Being. No matter what their evolutionary stage of religious development is found to have been at the time of “discovery,” most were found to believe in a Supreme God over all other gods and spirits. As such, the concept of a single Supreme Being remains in most of the religion’s as evidence that the masses strayed away from monotheism by giving some of God’s attributes to other aspects of creation, which eventually came to be regarded as lesser gods in some cases and as intercessors in others. Nevertheless, a Supreme God, in whatever form He takes, is at the core of most religions.
However, there does remain an aspect of belief in God which defies all logic and reason, but which has become a corner stone of faith. It is the belief that God became man. Where the original monotheistic belief in God degenerated into a belief that there must be intermediaries between human beings and the Supreme Being to either convey human quests or to act on behalf of God in the world, the intermediaries became objects of worship. The intermediaries were often conceived as spirits found in all manifestations of nature. Consequently, humans from primitive times have worshiped spirits of the forest, rivers, skies and the earth etc., until the present time. Occasionally nature itself was worshiped, and at other times, symbols representing nature were worshiped. The religious systems, which evolved from these types of beliefs tended to be localized and remain scattered among primitive people around the world till today. Such beliefs did not converge in the form of a single belief system of international impact, as far as is known in the current records of human history.
On the other hand, where the monotheistic belief degenerated into the personification of God’s power as separate intermediary entities represented by images, idols became a focal point for worshipping God. The powers of God became gods. Such beliefs have culminated in ancient and modern times as natural religions of international impact. Ancient Egyptian, Greek and Roman religions have died out due to the complete subversion of these empires by Christianity.
However, the Indian expression of Hinduism survived both Muslim and Christian colonization and remains the national religion of approximately one billion people in India. Christianity and Islam, with exception of Bali in Indonesia, have supplanted their direct international impact in the majority of the Far East. However, the different forms of Buddhism, its offshoot, have become the main religion of hundreds of millions in the Far East. Different forms of this Hindu reform movement continue to spread in the West today.
Man is God
According to Hinduism, the basic concept is that everything is God. There is, fundamentally, no distinction between God and His creation. In Hindu philosophy, every living being has a self or a soul that is called Atman. It is generally believed that the soul is actually God, called Brahman. Consequently, the essence of Hindu belief is the idea that Atman and Brahman are one and the same; in other words, the human soul is divine. Furthermore, human society is divided into castes or classes, where each caste represents human beings who came into existence from different parts of the divine being, Brahman. The upper caste, the Brahmins, came from the head of God; whereas, the lowest caste, the Sudras, came from God’s feet. Though there are officially only four main castes, there are, in reality, many sub-castes. Each one of the main castes is subdivided into thousands of lesser castes. Hindus believe that when a person dies, he or she is reincarnated. The soul, Atman, of the dead person never dies but is continually reborn. If people are good in this life, then they will be reborn into a higher level of the caste system in their next life. Conversely, if they are bad in this life, they will be reborn into a lower level, which is one of the main reasons why so many Hindus commit suicide annually. Daily, newspapers regularly record incidents of individuals and families hanging themselves from fans in their homes.
In a recent edition of one of the local papers, a Hindu man killed himself when India lost a cricket match to Sri Lanka. When one’s belief system espouses reincarnation, suicide becomes an easy route to evade difficulties in this life.
When a person reaches the top caste, the Brahmins, after various reincarnations, the cycle of rebirth ends, and he reunites with Brahman. This process of reunification is called Moksha, and in Buddhism it is called Nirvana. The Atman becomes once again reunited with Brahman. Thus, man becomes God.
Cont. (Creator or Creation)
Do sinners deserve to go to Hell forever? Will only one group of people be saved, and the rest damned? Should finite sins merit eternal punishment? Should God punish those who reject him? Is Hell Just? Welcome to the public debate.
Wednesday, 18th January 2012
Abrar House, 45 Crawford Place, London
Abdullah Al Andalusi – Portuguese revert to Islam, and International speaker on Islamic thought.
Farhan Qureshi – American Ex-Qadiyani Agnostic speaker on Eastern Philosophy and Universalism.
There was an echo in Youtube and Facebook about this video “Why I hate Religion, But Love Jesus”. This video published in Jan 10, just only 13 days, 16 millions viewer watch the video. It was popular so I just take a look.
Just a few days later, there was response from Catholics, Atheist, and etc regarding this video. The most popular response is below from TalkIslam.com.
So the third popular response video is from Catholic churches.
How do you see it?
Dr Zakir Naik is one of best comparison theologies in Islam. His book and his understanding of Bible and Quran is astonishing and great. A 3 hours debate between Dr Zakir Naik (Islam) and Pastor Ruknuddin (Christianity) is a must watch debate for who that searching for understand both view of “Crucified of Jesus”.
Let watch it.